p2pnet - rss feed: Teacher fired for loyalty oath refusal
p2pnet news | Freedom:- The US loyalty oath was added to the California state Constitution in the 1950s during the infamous McCarthy era —- the years of the American Inquisition.
Today, “its main effect is to weed out religious believers, particularly Quakers and Jehovah’s Witnesses,” says the Los Angeles Times.
The quote comes in a story describing how lifelong Quaker pacifist Wendy Gonaver was offered a job at Cal State Fullerton this academic year.
She didn’t want to put her name to the California loyalty oath as it stood, but said she’d sign, “if she could attach a brief statement expressing her views, a practice allowed by other state institutions,” says the story.
But Fullerton insisted that she sign the oath if she wanted the job”.
“The position of the university is that her entire added material was against the law,” Cal State spokeswoman Clara Potes-Fellow is quoted as saying.
In February, “another Cal State instructor, Quaker math teacher Marianne Kearney-Brown, was fired because she inserted the word ‘nonviolently’ when she signed the oath,” says the LA Times going on:
“She was quickly rehired after her case attracted media attention.”
When Gonaver was offered a job teaching American studies, “she was pleased to be headed back to the classroom to talk about one of her favorite themes” —– protecting constitutional freedoms,” says the story.
But the day before class began, “she lost the job because she did not sign a loyalty oath swearing to ‘defend’ the U.S. and California constitutions ‘against all enemies, foreign and domestic’.”
Adds the LA Times >>>
UC Berkeley was the first to impose a tough anti-communist loyalty oath in 1949 and fired 31 professors who refused to sign.
After a version of the oath was added to the state Constitution, courts eventually struck down its harshest elements but let stand the requirement of defending the constitutions. In one court test, personal statements accompanying the oath were deemed constitutional as long as they did not nullify the meaning of the oath.
Now, the University of California advises new employees who balk at signing the pledge that they can submit an addendum, as long as it does not negate the oath.
Stay tuned.
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Los Angeles Times - Teacher fired for refusing to sign loyalty oath, May 2, 2008
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May 3rd, 2008 at 6:50 am
Jehovah’s Witnesses and the flag salute.
I was born into the Jehovah’s Witnesses in 1957.I was the good little JW boy who got beaten up in the school yard for not saluting the flag and remaining seated for the Star Spangled Banner as demanded by my Jehovah’s Witnesses leaders.
This was the ‘better dead than red’ era of the 1960’s, I suffered much,only to learn that the Watchtower corporation is just another made up man-made religion and not the true one.
Kids suffer because of arbitrary rules by Jehovah’s Witnesses leaders,senile old men squatting in their insulated ivory tower.
I now proudly fly the Flag at my home
May 3rd, 2008 at 8:33 am
” This was the ‘better dead than red’ era of the 1960’s, I suffered much,only to learn that the Watchtower corporation is just another made up man-made religion and not the true one. ”
Got news for you.
They are ALL man made.
While there MAY be a true god ( for another debate ), all religions
were created by man to control man, and for no other reason.
No matter how much you legislate religion, you can’t enforce ‘Faith’.
May 3rd, 2008 at 9:23 am
Reader is right on,some relig are more benevolent than others, but the Jehovah Witness are wolves in sheep’s clothing
May 3rd, 2008 at 12:06 pm
The California US loyalty oath is anticonstitutional because it encroaches the freedom of speech just like the flag burning law.
This law is nul and unenforcable.on’t worry about it. Trying to enforce this law is a crime punishable by fines and prison terms.
Cal State Fullerton is breaking the federal law and the persons responsible for that should be prosecuted.
Wendy Gonaver must be rehired or they must be some serious consequences.
Listen I don’t follow any religion but the freedom of religion is in the constitution and should be enforced nationwide.
And by the way since I swore to ‘defend’ the U.S constitution ‘against all enemies, foreign and domestic, shall I consider the people involved in this constitutional violation as domestic enemies?
May 3rd, 2008 at 1:42 pm
No matter how much you legislate religion, you can’t enforce ‘Faith’.
Good beaviour can be enforced only while you are lookking. At all othe times, goo behaviour, whatever that is, cannot be enforced. That is 99.9 percent of the time. So oaths are meaningless game playing.
May 3rd, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Not all religions are about control, it depends on the doctrine of that particular church. Many religions are about self assessment, and self reflection. Comparison with holy men, and the strive to better the self’s relations with the neighbors and people around them.
I can’t say much about this story, because the key elements are missing:
1) A full copy of the oath she was to sign.
2) A full copy of her amendments.
It’s impossible for anyone to pass judgment on the state, this woman, or her beliefs, with the information provided so far.
May 3rd, 2008 at 5:19 pm
Jehovah’s Witnesses are patriotic citizens moreso than the average, and although they respect their country, it’s laws, and the flag, they will not salute it which they consider and act of idolatry, or a form of worship other than what is due the true God. Nor do they indulge in nationalistic fervour which has so often been used to rouse people to war and genocide. Because they love one another and their fellow man in obedience to Jesus’ command, they also refuse to take up arms to slaughter others, no matter what the cause. Christians are also no part of the world in that their highest allegiance is to God’s Kingdom, which will put an end to all others. Meantime they also subject themselves to worldly authority.
The opposers to true Christians are as the sands of the sea, the worst being some who used to be among us but had to be removed because of their own wickedness. Yet the Truth continues to thrive through God’s blessing. Many of these opposers are unreasoning, animalistic and bent on malicious slander and deception, and unfortunately the Internet provides them with a convenient forum to further their cause against innocent peace loving people who do no harm to anyone, and only do good.
These opposers constantly scour the Net looking for opportunity to mislead and air their unfounded grievances, as already shown in this short column. However the truth about them can be found on their official Web site at http://www.watchtower.org/
May 3rd, 2008 at 7:49 pm
Knowledge is free
Religion is not
Lighten up
May 3rd, 2008 at 9:39 pm
“You received free, give free”. True knowledge is free, but printing and bills require money. However we never solicit (rob), tithe, or extort. We are supported by voluntary donations only and it is not a feature of our services.
If being a part of it was no joy we are always free to leave
May 4th, 2008 at 1:38 am
You cannot legislate national pride, patriotism or beliefs. Attempts to try are antithetical to the free society that we strive to create (I hope) for ourselves. She should sue the college and the state for all the attention, debate and money she can.
May 4th, 2008 at 2:20 am
wow. this law fits fine with the cult of dh. what a nut case
May 4th, 2008 at 4:02 am
Jehovah’s Witnesses are 100% intolerant fanatics they go on foaming at the mouth rants aganist anyone who exposes their fraud for God cult.
Yes they DEMAND the ‘right’ to go knocking on doors to the point of intrusive illegal trespassing on private property but go nuts if anyone questions their bogus dogmas.
They are a religion of hate to the core.
May 4th, 2008 at 4:06 am
Jehovah’s Witnesses say they ‘don’t go to war’ they just make others fight and die for their freedoms.
They are a dog eat dog cult and infight among themselves.
May 4th, 2008 at 4:23 am
Go here for mostly unbiased google search results for Jehovah Witness and what they are really like
http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&ned=us&q=Jehovah%20Witness&sa=N&tab=nw
May 5th, 2008 at 9:14 am
you expound upon your hate of Jehovahs Witnesses and then you give “unbiased” search results?
i am not a witness, but i also believe in the non-glorification of state.
Such fervent nationalism leads to only bad things.
We should NOT blindly follow our leaders.
It is no longer a question on unalienable liberty.
the citizen must fight for rights he wants, and the state assigns rights to the individual.
May 5th, 2008 at 10:06 am
The search results are google not mine I don’t “hate” the Jehovah’s Witness,nobody say’s to ‘blindly follow our leaders’ Tammy is a troll
May 5th, 2008 at 12:22 pm
tammo.mcillheney@gmail.com
i apologize for the above post, i was on a time constraint, and i substitute the following:
you expound upon your virilent hate of jehovahs witnesses and you expect us to trust your “unbiased” sources? regardless of whether or not they are unbiased, i am not going to trust you to present them.
Before i begin my rant, i would like to clarify a few points that may otherwise be assumed.
!) i am NOT a Jehovahs Witness.
2)i am NOT particularly religious.
3) I AM foremost a man of science.
4) I AM a opponent and critic of the United States government.
and now onward
I support the jehovahs witnesses and all those who will not pledge allegiance to the united states.
that is not hoow our country was founded.
We should NOT pledge allegiance to our government, but rather our GOVERNMENT should pledge allegiance, to we the people.
Benjamin Franklin himself once said:
“The government should be the servants, and the people the rulers”
The government as imagined by the Founding Fathers was a tool of the people for the implementation of the will of the people,
as well as a shield for their defense.
It is a common thread throughout all of leftist ideals and dogma that events and proceedings undera stagnant, corrupt and tryanical government can produce those few capable idividuals who are most able to lead.
This has been proven throughout history, most notably in the American Revolution, THe Civil War, THe Russian Revolution (Lenin and Trotsky, NOT STALIN), and the revolts against arapartheid in South Africa.
But i personally believe that it is political stagnation and oppression that causes individuals wit hthe potential ability to develop it fully in hope of bringing about change.
FOr change must be constant, as no social/political system can ever be perfect and all are subject to the effects of entrophy, although in political systems it tends towards corruption becuase of the basic human instinct of greed.
Now consider this.
The american government has been stagnant for close to two hundred and twenty years, become a fecund breeding ground for corruption all this time.
It has rapidly become subject to the class divide between rich and poor(er), starting with the beginning of the industrial age and the rise of corporations and bigt business.
THe american government has rapidly becone the bastion of the rich, and also caustic and beligerent, perhaps tyranical in its dealing with the resto f the world, as well to a lesser extent to its citizens.
It is no longer a question of unalienable liberty, but rather one of what rigths the citizens are willing to fight for, and what liberties the state is willing to assign to the individual.
In these days, after Apocolypse Day(January 20, 2000),starting with the Patriot Acts, the government is rapidly taking away rights that have been granted/won in the past, All in the name of “safety”.
And again, i must quote Benjamin Franklin who once said:”Those who would trade essential liberty for temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety.”
Along with the right to privacy, the right of free speech is also being challenged.
Since the signing of the constitution, Free Speech has changed to Free Speech-without-hatefulspeech-without-unpleasantspeech-without-notnicespeech-without-distatefulspeech-without controversialspeech-without-unapprovedspeech.
In addition, American Dictatorship has rapidly replaced British Imperialism as the cause of global-scale evil in this world. THe american government has started conflicts and wars across the globe in order to protect its vested economic interests, all while causing untold damage to million of live and eradicating millions more.
THis is why i will NEVER pledge allegiance to the United states ever again, beacuse it is a corrupt, evil establishment that denies even its own citizens the basic human right of liberty, and has no morals against the death and mutilation of millions of Iraqis/Afghans/Arabics/Koreans/Vietnamese/Cuban/Iranian/TIbetian/Rwandan/anybody non american.
GOD DAMN AMERICA
May 5th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
What an idiot. Yet another fool that doesn’t realize the basis for saluting our flag. It is an indication of loyalty to the nation that gives them the freedom to post stupid cr@p like they have above. If you hate America so much THEN LEAVE US…PLEASE! We don’t want unpatriotic fools living here if all they do is moan and complain…poor pitiful you…you use everything good that this great nation gives you and have nothing but bitterness and spite to give back. Leave, we don’t need garbage like that.
Sheesh. The very freedoms America gives you are wasted on you.
May 5th, 2008 at 7:52 pm
The article states that the loyalty oath’s “main effect is to weed out religious believers, particularly Quakers and Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Why? They take their religious stand seriously, and won’t lie about it. Good for them.
Reader’s Write comment says, “The very freedoms America gives you are wasted on you.” America does not give freedoms. People fight for those freedoms. Freedom is not wasted on anyone because they dissent. That is how the freedoms were won in the first place. I also can’t ignore Mary’s claiming “I don’t hate the Jehovah’s Witness,” or give her any credibility for being “unbiased” after her tirade of abuse. The article was not even about them, only giving them a mention as a victim of the oath.
The comments here are deplorable in light of the seriousness of the real issues. I hope that the injustice done to this teacher can help redefine the law to end the abuse of this loyalty oath.
May 6th, 2008 at 8:13 am
i do not hate america.
i hate the american government.
they are two entirely separate things.
do you have any idea some of the things the American government has done and continues to do so?
all without the peoples consent?
the interests of corporations are largely responsible for such atrocities.
some members of the bureaucracy are almost certainly pure in motive and means, but the vast majority of higher government is large older, white, male, and RICH. there is a reason some corporations put millions of dollars into COngress and the Executive branch.
Money corrupts, even worse than power.
I am not saying that we need to get rid our of current form of government, but it does need to be purged.
On the whole, the foundations of the system are solid, but what good is a solid foundation if filth grows on top of it?
May 8th, 2008 at 5:21 am
I have to agree with Tammo. Were a government (any one) try to make me swear a loyalty oath to them in order to work for them, I would tell them where I go. I would say “Fine, just don’t give me classified documents or top-secret stuff if you are really worried about me!”
All of these things about ‘defending the Constitution’ and ‘defending the state constitutions’ are illegal because frankly…. the Constitution of the United States says they are! It SPECIFICALLY says that no one may be forced to take an oath to a country or person, period and done with.
Frankly, the Constitution is just a piece of paper, though a good one with the basics of law in this country…. but we haven’t been adhering to it very much lately.
May 18th, 2008 at 1:31 pm
The Jehovah’s Witnesses have settled lawsuits alleging church policies protected pedophile men who sexually abused children for many years.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21917798/
The victims were required to sign gag orders to prevent them from saying anything about the money or more importantly about their abusers. Yet more importantly the court documents that were part of the five year legal battle shows exactly what despicable sinks of debauchery that supposed leaders and elders of Jehovah’s Witnesses will go to in order to protect pedophiles.
The written record is incriminating and shows the cover up, protection and enabling of Jehovah’s Witness child molesters around the world.
June 5th, 2008 at 7:49 pm
Since pedophilia and child molestation became a big drawcard in the News, some with a violent and unreasoning hatred of Jehovah’s Witnesses, because of having to be expelled from among them, took advantage of it to further their evil agendas in heaping further reproach upon them and their God, by setting up elaborate online schemes purporting to “expose” the Witnesses in this.
The truth is that although such horrible crimes are more the rule than the exception among the clergy of Christendom, such cases of child abuse are rare among Jehovah’s Witnesses, whose lives are among the most morally clean of all. If such a case were to occur, they endeavour to apply Biblical admonition, as in all areas of life. When the law requires that such be reported to police, they also do that, as well as investigate the situation internally.
Matters are scrutinized by a group of elders, who are trained to handle problems which may arise in the Congregation. If an allegation is denied, and there are no witnesses, in the past there would be little that could be done, except to apply restriction safeguards. Since laws now require a police report, that is carried out as well. There is never any “coverup” as with the churches of Christendom.
If an allegation were found to be true, the offender would not only be reported to the police as required, but also likely removed from the Congregation, unless he could demonstrate true repentance. Even if he could, he would be under restrictions possibly for the rest of his life, and including not being able to be alone with children or to show affection toward them.
Jesus came to call sinners, not the converted. However, they are required to change any wrong behaviour and attitudes before becoming baptized Jehovah’s Witnesses, which the vast majority successfully do. On rare occasions bad seeds will creep in undetected, and sometimes due to imperfection and outside influences, bad attitudes can return temporarily at least.
But the greatest incentive for them to keep themselves free from blame is fear of God’s displeasure, and to survive the coming destruction upon the incorrigibly wicked, and attain to the reward of eternal life as promised.
June 5th, 2008 at 8:38 pm
Tammo said, “you expound upon your virilent hate of jehovahs witnesses and you expect us to trust your “unbiased” sources? regardless of whether or not they are unbiased, i am not going to trust you to present them.”
Well said Tammo. I suspect that most others too would see through their vile accusations against the Witnesses.
We are under compulsion to love God and neighbour. That leaves no room for abuse.
We are not opposed to the govt though, as we are also under compulsion to obey the law, and we love our country. We don’t feel that we need to do an act of “idol worship” however in order to prove that, as many seem to feel. We are also compelled to obey God as the highest authority, and which at times may conflict with manmade laws, statutes, or requirements.
We also respect the flag, but will not salute a piece of cloth. Those with their nationalistic fervour aroused may be offended by that, and feel that it merely shows loyalty and respect for our country. We do respect our countries and their flag symbols, and are loyal citizens. Above all however we are loyal to God and his requirements for Christians. We do not abandon Christian principles in times of warfare in favour of blind nationalism. We would rather be jailed or even killed than violate our Christian consciences and take up arms against our fellow men and our Brothers in other areas.
In the concentration camps of Nazi Germany, Jehovah’s Witnesses were the only group who could be freed just for signing a paper, resigning their religion. The majority did not. Among those who did, most later returned to their faith. Many also were killed and threatened with execution because they would not abandon their faith or embrace Nazism, not even giving the Nazi salute. Again the vast majority remained faithful, and often the threats were a bluff, but sometimes not.
June 5th, 2008 at 8:44 pm
Since Hitler was a good Catholic, who made a Nazi concordat with them, another way for JWs to obtain freedom was simply to make the sign of the cross, which they would not do either, the cross being a pagan symbol for idol worshipers adopted by the Church.