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	<title>Comments on: Apple&#8217;s university gravy-trains</title>
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		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12622</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 18:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Everyone here is missing the point. The big private Universities (e.g. Duke) are in intense competition for excellent students who are also able to afford ~$50k / year (tuition + books + living expenses). Giving students an ipod adds to attarctiveness and is a drop in the ocean compared to total costs. For Duke it is a smart move, even if the academic rationale is slim for many students.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everyone here is missing the point. The big private Universities (e.g. Duke) are in intense competition for excellent students who are also able to afford ~$50k / year (tuition + books + living expenses). Giving students an ipod adds to attarctiveness and is a drop in the ocean compared to total costs. For Duke it is a smart move, even if the academic rationale is slim for many students.</p>
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		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12620</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 13:30:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-12620</guid>
		<description>Nothing like add ons and frills to increase ones education costs. This strikes be as rather excessive and frivilous. You can be sure it will be popular but the thing about grants is that it never lasts for any great length of time. At some point it runs out. 

Many of the uni&#039;s are turning to a welfare dole of services such as Napster. Tacking this cost as a hidden one within the bill. One such student said that he asked as he didn&#039;t want it. He found out later that it was there and he was left with no choice in whether it would be paid or not. As you can imagine he is steaming about a service he neither plans to use nor endorses being crammed into his education costs. 

This is nothing but welfare for the corporation at student and family cost. 

So are we teaching our students to now be good little consumers? Are we teaching families how to scrimp and save for twenty years to help pay big musics tab? 

It was just such actions as hidden and excessive taxes that started this country in the first place. I refer you to the Boston Tea Party.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nothing like add ons and frills to increase ones education costs. This strikes be as rather excessive and frivilous. You can be sure it will be popular but the thing about grants is that it never lasts for any great length of time. At some point it runs out. </p>
<p>Many of the uni&#8217;s are turning to a welfare dole of services such as Napster. Tacking this cost as a hidden one within the bill. One such student said that he asked as he didn&#8217;t want it. He found out later that it was there and he was left with no choice in whether it would be paid or not. As you can imagine he is steaming about a service he neither plans to use nor endorses being crammed into his education costs. </p>
<p>This is nothing but welfare for the corporation at student and family cost. </p>
<p>So are we teaching our students to now be good little consumers? Are we teaching families how to scrimp and save for twenty years to help pay big musics tab? </p>
<p>It was just such actions as hidden and excessive taxes that started this country in the first place. I refer you to the Boston Tea Party.</p>
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		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12616</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 09:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I don&#039;t like my school fees being burdoned with unnecessary crap.

Cable tv and telephone are one thing, but ipods are not.

I&#039;ve defended the ipod as a drm free device worth buying, but I still don&#039;t condone the idea of tacking these things onto school fees or our taxes.

No Corporate Welfare.. none for napster.. none for apple.. none for halliburton.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t like my school fees being burdoned with unnecessary crap.</p>
<p>Cable tv and telephone are one thing, but ipods are not.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve defended the ipod as a drm free device worth buying, but I still don&#8217;t condone the idea of tacking these things onto school fees or our taxes.</p>
<p>No Corporate Welfare.. none for napster.. none for apple.. none for halliburton.</p>
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		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12611</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 08:20:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Gravy-train is right. There is nothing in this about education, it&#039;s about money flowing away from us (rapidly) and into the pockets of the Universities and other businesses. It just occured to me that there are so many people up in arms about the RIAA cutting deals with Universities to use Napster, but are indifferent to what Apple has done. Isn&#039;t it the same thing? Either get locked into using Windows and the supporting players or get locked in to using the ipod and one music store. Either way the consumers are the ones behind bars.  

An iPod is nice, innovation in the classroom is even nicer, but all four sides (RIAA/Stanford et al? and Apple/Duke et al) seem to forget that students should have a choice in what they want to use when learning. 

I have to agree with you that these companies and organizations have had it too good recently, to the point where they expect us to dance when they dangle any kind of carrot. It&#039;s all beginning to wear thin.

- Nadine Edwards</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gravy-train is right. There is nothing in this about education, it&#8217;s about money flowing away from us (rapidly) and into the pockets of the Universities and other businesses. It just occured to me that there are so many people up in arms about the RIAA cutting deals with Universities to use Napster, but are indifferent to what Apple has done. Isn&#8217;t it the same thing? Either get locked into using Windows and the supporting players or get locked in to using the ipod and one music store. Either way the consumers are the ones behind bars.  </p>
<p>An iPod is nice, innovation in the classroom is even nicer, but all four sides (RIAA/Stanford et al? and Apple/Duke et al) seem to forget that students should have a choice in what they want to use when learning. </p>
<p>I have to agree with you that these companies and organizations have had it too good recently, to the point where they expect us to dance when they dangle any kind of carrot. It&#8217;s all beginning to wear thin.</p>
<p>- Nadine Edwards</p>
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		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12608</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 07:09:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-12608</guid>
		<description>&quot;Apple&#039;s university gravy-trains&quot;

Huh? Yeah, the title isn&#039;t untrue, but its hardly at the crux of what this story is about. Is it Jon?

I think it&#039;d be alot more informative if you were to actually do some research (i know, its easier to flail like a poorly informed cut-and-paster) and find out who initiated the absurd notion of drawing up a grant to give all student iPods.

Whilst I doubt Apple objected to the purchase, I also doubt that they initiated the entire affair. Someone at this university is a bit too smitten with the lil&#039; white box and made a really stupid, economically unsound decision.

&quot;why don&#039;t they launch school projects to develop them?&quot;
As sweet as this notion is - cute, even - its even more economically unsound. And whilst the schools would&#039;ve had a fabbo &quot;make your own fully functioning DAP&quot; project, whats the point in engaging so many learning / educational resources just to produced a product, whose engineering is really only as complex as the case is small, for an over saturated market? An idea that makes even less sense if you look at the short-sphere of manufacturing it&#039;d go through to meet the (so-called) &quot;demand&quot; for iPods on these campuses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Apple&#8217;s university gravy-trains&#8221;</p>
<p>Huh? Yeah, the title isn&#8217;t untrue, but its hardly at the crux of what this story is about. Is it Jon?</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;d be alot more informative if you were to actually do some research (i know, its easier to flail like a poorly informed cut-and-paster) and find out who initiated the absurd notion of drawing up a grant to give all student iPods.</p>
<p>Whilst I doubt Apple objected to the purchase, I also doubt that they initiated the entire affair. Someone at this university is a bit too smitten with the lil&#8217; white box and made a really stupid, economically unsound decision.</p>
<p>&#8220;why don&#8217;t they launch school projects to develop them?&#8221;<br />
As sweet as this notion is &#8211; cute, even &#8211; its even more economically unsound. And whilst the schools would&#8217;ve had a fabbo &#8220;make your own fully functioning DAP&#8221; project, whats the point in engaging so many learning / educational resources just to produced a product, whose engineering is really only as complex as the case is small, for an over saturated market? An idea that makes even less sense if you look at the short-sphere of manufacturing it&#8217;d go through to meet the (so-called) &#8220;demand&#8221; for iPods on these campuses.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12603</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 05:47:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-12603</guid>
		<description>Just use a portable tape recorder. It&#039;s cheaper. But then it&#039;s not an iPod story and therefore not interesting and/or sexy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just use a portable tape recorder. It&#8217;s cheaper. But then it&#8217;s not an iPod story and therefore not interesting and/or sexy.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Reader's Write</title>
		<link>http://www.p2pnet.net/story/4600/comment-page-1#comment-12587</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader's Write</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Apr 2005 02:21:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-12587</guid>
		<description>I am sure that Apple is just tickled to death. It takes a lot of time to write up a grant application. In the past businesses such as Apple and IBM were known for donating equipment to schools for educational purposes. It was properly thought that getting them used to their particular brand would develop brand loyalty and later in life they would have a customer that would purchase their products. (and they do!) It is an investment in the future. 

It seems now that just like satellite radio, the latest tend is to get you to pay for what you got for free. The corporations of the world seem to have been successful in this idea that you owe them. We see it every day or so in the actions of the RIAA, the MPAA, and many others. This unstated but implied idea that they have product and as a good little consumer you are obligated to buy the product. I couldn&#039;t disagree more. Its my wallet, my money and they can&#039;t force me to pull it out and spent it where I don&#039;t want too. Spend your money as a vote for what you believe in. Those that don&#039;t get a share will have to figure out what they are doing wrong. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am sure that Apple is just tickled to death. It takes a lot of time to write up a grant application. In the past businesses such as Apple and IBM were known for donating equipment to schools for educational purposes. It was properly thought that getting them used to their particular brand would develop brand loyalty and later in life they would have a customer that would purchase their products. (and they do!) It is an investment in the future. </p>
<p>It seems now that just like satellite radio, the latest tend is to get you to pay for what you got for free. The corporations of the world seem to have been successful in this idea that you owe them. We see it every day or so in the actions of the RIAA, the MPAA, and many others. This unstated but implied idea that they have product and as a good little consumer you are obligated to buy the product. I couldn&#8217;t disagree more. Its my wallet, my money and they can&#8217;t force me to pull it out and spent it where I don&#8217;t want too. Spend your money as a vote for what you believe in. Those that don&#8217;t get a share will have to figure out what they are doing wrong.</p>
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